Rock Around the Croc: The Classical Era (Still)

It’s actually super intimidating to try to start writing about the Classical era, or the Viennese High Classical Style. As I mentioned last week, the three towering figures of the Classical era were Haydn, Mozart and Beethoven (the latter two of whom studied under “Papa Haydn”). Haydn alone wrote 106 symphonies, thanks to the patronage he enjoyed as composer to the wealthy Esterazy family, the greatest landowner family in the Habsburg Empire. Mozart may have written about 41 symphonies, but it’s hard to get a firm number on that because he also re-worked or added to some symphonies by other composers, and after his death numerous spurious works appeared with his name on them. And that’s just the symphonies – add in the string quartets, solo concerti, operas, sonatas and musical works of any other description, and you can see you will never exhaust the music of these three men, let alone the rest of the Classical era. Hence my problem – where to start?

Let’s start with some music. Here’s Haydn’s Trumpet concerto in E-flat major:

I picked this for a few reasons. First, it features on the list of five essential works by Haydn, with the following description: “Haydn’s genius transformed this martial instrument into an eloquent and charming soloist, both in the inspired slow movement and in the sparkling finale.” Indeed, in orchestral works I usually think of the trumpet as blasting out simplistic fanfares, like you’ll hear in Handel’s Messiah, and outside of that, I think of trumpets as being for jazz or ska. If you listen to the second movement alone (7:08 to 11:05), and you watch the trumpet line (fourth line from the top, “Tromba solo”), you see and hear how lyrical and flowing the instrument can be, even if you don’t read sheet music.

Second, it’s a great example of a solo concerto, which I discussed while I was still working on the Baroque era. My simplistic but useful definition of a concerto is an orchestral work designed to show off the virtuosity of one or more instruments. How very like a composer to say “you know, I’m going to see what I’m can do with this trumpet that most people overlook” and then explore the studio space.

Third, because that discussion first appeared when talking about the Baroque, it’s a reminder that splitting these eras up into neat little dates simply does not reflect reality. We can say the Baroque era ended with the death of Bach in 1750, but what we now call classical elements had already appeared before then, and Baroque forms and ideas continued. Mozart himself learned much of what he knew about polyphony by studying Bach’s fugues and preludes in the Well-Tempered Klavier.

So what makes Classical music classical? How about a quick explanation of why we tend to call all “old-timey” music classical, and set ourselves up for ridicule from snobs who say “well technically you’re listening to Romantic era music” (swirls brandy snifter) “you uncultured sack of monkey snot.” In the late 1800s, as concert music continued to expand its reach to the masses (a process that began at the beginning of the Classical period and expanded considerably during the Romantic period), new and famous concert houses were built, including Royal Albert Hall (1871) and Carnegie Hall (1891). In order to draw in audiences, the owners promised performances of “established masterpieces” that have since become part of the standard orchestral repertoire. They were “the classics,” in the same sense that we describe Led Zeppelin or Pink Floyd as Classic Rock. So if you like classical music, you are probably referring to what musicologists now call concert music, whereas the Classical Era refers to that music developed during the Enlightenment in what is called the Viennese High Classical Style. (That style ended about halfway through Beethoven’s career, according to Richard Wagner, when Beethoven killed it dead by writing symphonies so good that there was no point in writing symphonies anymore, and future music would have to explore new forms).

So let’s talk about Viennese High Classical Style, and let’s do it with a comparison. In these posts I’m borrowing heavily from Robert Greenberg’s wonderful “How to Listen to and Understand Great Music” series, but I don’t have to borrow his same examples all the time, so let’s compare Bach’s “Little” Fugue in G Minor to the second movement of Mozart’s Eine Kleine Nachtmusik. First the Bach:

And the Mozart:

Greenberg wonderfully describes the difference between Baroque and Classical as “music about process and surface complexity, on the one hand, and vocal lyricism and studied simplicity, on the other.” [Fun note: in the movie Alien, Tom Skerritt’s character Dallas retreats to the escape pod while Kane has the facehugger on him so he can listen to this Mozart piece. Ridley Scott wanted to use the Mozart because he loved that idea that some works of art are so enduring that they will be enjoyed even in the distant future. So that’s why Mozart is in Alien.]

Let’s talk in more detail about the musical differences between Baroque and Classical. The first (following Greenberg) is instrumentation. Bach composed his keyboard works for organ and harpsichord. These are great instruments for the Baroque era because they do not allow for dynamic gradation. That is, you can’t gradually increase the volume of a note by striking the key harder. Here’s a cool example (the first 2:30 of the video gives you the idea):

But around 1700 the piano was first developed, an instrument that uses felt-covered hammers to strike the strings, using a mechanism that allows for graded dynamics (forte, mezzo, piano, anywhere in between), allowing for much more expressive opportunities. Here’s Haydn’s Little Serenade with cool visuals:

The second musical difference is texture. Musical textures can be of three varieties: monophony, polyphony and homophony. A harpsichord is an ideal instrument for polyphonic compositions because the attack (the sound of the note when first struck) is so sharp that it stands out, and the decay (the sound the note makes as it develops) is so rapid that it doesn’t muddy up the following notes. Playing Baroque music on a piano, by contrast, takes an enormous amount of control to keep the notes from bleeding into each other. In a homophonic texture, however, in which there are multiple voices but only one principle voice, you can drag the non-melodic notes out as long as you want without them interfering with the tune. Watch the left hand in the Haydn above, and you will see it’s not doing anything very complicated. It adds immeasurably to the composition without distracting from what the right hand is doing.

Which leads into the third difference, the rise of tune. If you listen to that Haydn enough, you can remember it and hum or whistle the tune, which is the principle musical theme of the piece. You really can’t whistle a fugue. That’s not the point of a fugue, which is designed to express decorative complexity tempered with “iron-fisted control” (to use Greenberg’s favorite phrase).

Finally, the difference is in expressive content. “Bach’s fugue is about codifying, exploring and demonstrating the polyphonic potential of the fugue subject.” A classical-era sonata is about using vocal quality and lyricism “that creates a mood of intimacy and expressive immediacy.” Now the interesting thing about this last notion is that, in the classical era, that vocal quality is something of a misdirection, and here I want to get to something Car In expressed a long time ago, when she was talking about Tool and Radiohead. She said people like those bands because they are complicated. That’s true, in an important sense. But simplicity is the kind of thing that can wax and wane in popularity. During the Enlightenment, with the rise of the middle class, social attitudes across Europe changed dramatically in very important ways, including those about the arts. When Haydn was on the scene, it became easy to dismiss fugues or other Baroque forms as outdated precisely because of how complex they sounded. I want something much simpler, much or everyman, not so snooty – and because of the rise of the doctrine of utilitarianism, people began to think of music in similar terms – that music which appeals to the greatest number of people is the greatest music. It’s easier to appeal to the masses with a pretty tune, a la Mozart or Haydn, than with a complex, notey, barrage of different instruments competing for musical space such as you find in a fugue. [Note: I’m not bagging on fugues, here, just discussing changing musical tastes.] I once watched an interview of Gene Simmons of Kiss, and the interviewer made a disparaging comment about Justin Bieber. Gene’s response was that Bieber’s music was good. The interviewer was shocked to hear this from Simmons, but Simmons explained that a lot of people like it, so it must be good. (“Good stuff is defined by the masses”). You can watch that interview here, featuring Gene Simmons being extremely Gene Simmons.

Perhaps more importantly, on the topic of whether people like complicated stuff, the reality is that Mozart wrote very complicated stuff. That being said, he just did it in a style that hides its complexity under the surface, whereas the Baroque composers put all of the complexity right up front, on full display. A Classical era listener may have sniffed that Bach sounded to unnatural, but there’s nothing natural about Haydn, Mozart or Beethoven either. All of them took musical concepts and assembled them through a process – and people like Mozart assembled them into a form that people can mistake for natural.

I also want to talk about simplicity of instrumentation, and the rise of the string quartet. If you want to listen to Bach’s Brandenberg Concerti, and you live before the invention of the record player, you’re going to need to invest a lot of time and money into assembling musicians who can play extremely complicated music, and have a stage large enough to fit them all. By contrast, assembling two violins, a viola and a bass for a string quartet is much more economical, and learning the music much more practical when it’s written specifically for listeners who want to be able to perform in their own homes. Here’s Haydn’s String Quartet in C, “The Bird”:

Another feature of the string quartet is that it is a representation of the more democratic attitudes that were sweeping through Europe. The music is designed as a conversation between the instruments than an opportunity for one of them to dominate the others. Listen to this piece and imagine you’re playing one of those instruments in your home with three of your friends – that is simply not possible when you’re talking about a work for full orchestra, doing music that only professionals can hope to master.

One more from Haydn, to reinforce my theme that we never really leave the past behind when it comes to music. Back in the Renaissance period, I spent a lot of time talking about the Catholic mass. Spend some time today listening to Haydn’s Nelson Mass. Recall that this was composed during the Napoleonic Wars and ask yourself whether this music has a bit of war in its DNA. I can’t help but think about Mozart’s Dies Irae when I hear this:

Franz Joseph Haydn (1732-1809) was born in Austria and raised in an untrained musical family near the Hungarian border. He was trained in music and sang in the church choir at Hainburg until he was nine years old, when he was taken to Vienna by the director of St. Stephen’s cathedral for a more comprehensive musical education. He got his first full-time job as a musician at the age of 25, after years of freelance work, and he composed an enormous body of work from then until his death at age 77. He was well-regarded throughout Europe during his own lifetime, which I think is cool. He married Maria Anna Theresia Keller in 1760, before they decided they didn’t like each other so they stayed married but both had lovers, and hey, who am I to judge? In 1803, he was forced to retire due to increasing illness, which was a torment to him because he was still flooded with new musical ideas for years, but unable to work them out as compositions. Some people have these amazing, creative minds.

This week I’ll play us out with Anymore, by Dig. They had a song called Believe that got some MTV play in the 1990s. I liked that song enough to buy their debut, self-titled album, and I really loved it. None of my friends ever understood why I liked it so much, and indeed I’ve never met anyone who is actually a fan of the band. I love how dreamy this one is:

May the Lord bless you, my wacky internet friends, and have a blessed Sunday. Your wit and goodness, even if only in a tiny little corner of the internet, makes the world that much better of a place, and that’s what I appreciate about you.


  1. Haydn has drama but not clashing. I always liked him.


    (Imgur video)

  3. Heh, the masks hid a lot. I was mouthing some pretty naughty stuff to douchy people when I had to wear a mask.


  5. Wakey wakey

    I was chewing food walking out of the kitchen when I had a mask. Because fuck that.

  6. Never having masked, I have retained my skills WRT macro and micro expressions.

  7. I have mixed feelings about this

    “Creepy Old Guy” versus “Narcissistic Influencer” … I want them to both lose

  8. Ok, not a lot of cold-weather women on here, but this is for the few. I got this for my birthday (ordered it) and I’m so excited. They have pretty wool ones, but those are dry clean only and with dogs … etc…

  9. Hmm …

  10. So where do you wear this wearable blanket? Ice fishing?

  11. Walking the dogs, taking care of the chickens, getting a christmas tree, watching a parade, etc etc.

    Any outdoor activity that isn’t running or skiing.

  12. If I ice fished, that would be perfect. I don’t.

  13. So, ethan doesn’t really enjoy the drown proofing.

  14. He needs to thicken the batter for greater buoyancy

  15. I have one pair of fleece lined hiking pants that pretty much does the same thing Carin and cost less than $40. But I don’t live in the arctic circle. We get zero to ten degrees below Fahrenheit for that one cold snap during only one or two weeks in Winter, most years. You probably have more use for a quick-slip on warmup type dealio.

    Did you see my comment yesterday about those stickers you sent with the seeds? Scott is delighted with them. I asked him to save the last one for when gas hits over $4.

  16. That “influencer” is a bitch. She’s wearing tights going so far up her ass they’re like a rectal exam and she doesn’t expect anyone to look at her??

    She’s an attention whore and it’s exactly what she wanted.

  17. Comment by Jimbro on December 5, 2021 8:22 am
    Hmm …


    Okay, why is this a thing? I hear about weirdness like this all the time. Nurses on Instagram and whatnot.

    I don’t get it.

  18. I have heavy winter leggings, etc, but sometimes you don’t want to wear all that. Running to the chicken coop, for example. Or taking the dogs out to go potty. The appeal of this is that I can just whip it on and off. If I’m going somewhere, I don’t have to wear the thick stuff IN THE car and overheat, I can just toss it on when I need it. It certainly is a luxury item, but it’s a birthday present.

    I’m forgot I tossed those stickers in there. I’m glad Scott likes them – lol.

  19. As a future creepy old man (because I’m not attractive and I try to be friendly) I’m siding with him without watching the video.

  20. SHE LITERALLY POSTS VIDEOS of herself, dressed like that, for people to look at.

    Some people are too fucking stupid.

  21. also – first I hate those leggings. They designed to do that to your ass – there is scrunching, and I think the fabric lifts to accentuate the butt. I hate hate hate them. There were viral videos of women wearing them in front of their husbands/etc – to SEE their reaction. All the reactions were of the drooling/frisky.

    So … women … can we … talk about this? You LITERALLY wear them to not only accentuate your ass, but to accentuate them as a SEXUAL part of your body. Then you get upset when people notice? GFY.

  22. It’s the usual definition of creepy, then, the wrong guy was looking.

  23. So … women … can we … talk about this? You LITERALLY wear them to not only accentuate your ass, but to accentuate them as a SEXUAL part of your body. Then you get upset when people notice? GFY.


    Comment by leoncaruthers on December 5, 2021 9:25 am
    It’s the usual definition of creepy, then, the wrong guy was looking


    All this is correct.

  24. I’ll be looking wondering HTF she can work out while simultaneously flossing her ass.

  25. Like Chris Rock says, “Sexual Harassment is when an ugly muthafucka trying to get himself some pussy. You won’t ever see Denzel Washington get hit up with it.”

  26. Yeah, I’m with the guy on this. I had a secretary who complained about the men staring at her boobs, and I said you might not want to wear low cut blouses then. If there’s an echo out of your cleavage, they’re gonna look.

  27. Sexual harassment in this office will not be reported, it will, however, be graded.

  28. Thought this was worth sharing. Probably will get pulled since it doesn’t meet the narrative.

  29. I actually hate it when women dress like that at the gym. It’s a terrible distraction. My attention is on the workout, and keeping my eyes and mind on the work is hard enough without the “more naked than a stripper” gym attire trying to steal my mindthoughts and soulpatterns.

  30. Its just so hypocritical. They OBVIOUSLY dress like that because they like the way it makes them look. they are flaunting what they have. Work out at home if you don’t want the “little people” to look at you.

  31. Also, there are a few things you actually can do to dissuade stares. When i do squats at a public gym, my ass is facing the wall or a direction where there are no people.

  32. I was driving down a long, straight, empty highway yesterday and the thought occurred to me that I had hoped to be gone from this earth before anybody took over Obama’s trophy as the worst president in US history. But I’m still here and Bribem is a lock to take that trophy when he exits in 24. It took 36 years for Obama to take the title from Carter and only 8 for Joe to snatch it Off Barack’s mantle. Is this a measuring stick for the acceleration of the decline of western civilization?

  33. I think a quick rundown of her instagram or tictoc page would show a lot of “here’s my ass isn’t it awesome” pictures.

    Yes, she’s a hypocritical, attention-whoring bitch.

  34. I never cared who was looking at my ass while squatting. Of course I haven’t done a squat in 25 years. All I know is that when I spotted another squatter back in the day they better have wiped their ass thoroughly.

  35. Morning, y’all. I was up late typing this, and then I couldn’t fall asleep for the longest time. I feel awful now. The great news is my legs are a little sore from my long run yesterday, but that’s it. Feeling excited that I can get back into it.

  36. I had the same realization as Chris Rock about the difference between romantic gesture and stalker activity. I was at college, listening to some young ladies talking about “I can’t believe that stalker bought you flowers!” And I was thinking he must be a pretty ugly dude, because I’d never heard of a girl being offended by flowers before.

  37. This, this shit is why lots of men just gave up. Can’t win, can’t break even, can’t get out of the game.

    Ain’t gonna be pretty when the whole thing breaks down, but I’m going to be laughing my ass off if I live long enough to see it.

  38. Pendejo, how can Biden take obama’s title when Obama is running things? This is his 3rd term, to “finish the job”.
    Biden is a diaper wearing puppet.

  39. “Biden is a diaper wearing puppet.”

    That’s exactly how he took the title, though.

  40. I dressed modestly for the gym out of courtesy to all the wimmens and other dude enthusiasts.

    Other than that, all I can do is show my daughter that a shabby schlub like me can make mom happy and be a good dad.

  41. If you are a fan of oratorio, Haydn has you covered there, too. Here is The Creation:

  42. You really think Biden will make it to ’24? I figure either the Alzheimer’s will escalate or he’ll be a covid martyr (he told you to get the shot, now look what you’ve done).

  43. Other than that, all I can do is show my daughter that a shabby schlub like me can make mom happy and be a good dad.


    I don’t think you’re a shabby schlub at all but the rest is hero material.

  44. When I use to go to the gym my goal was to not have people laugh at me. On the other hand, I’d probably laugh with them and start a nice friendship.

  45. When I go to the gym….

    Who am I trying to fool? I don’t go to the gym.

  46. He may not make it to 24. He’s in Weekend At Bernie’s territory now. I bought the book “Laptop From Hell” that was pimped at the hq last week. I’m about a third of the way through it. The whole Biden family are a bunch of sickos.

  47. She posted this to her 2000+ followers. hopefully none of them are staring at her butt:

  48. Back in high school, a guy who I didn’t know put a few secret admirer notes in my locker. He was a friend of a friend. As teenage boys go, he was awkward and not very attractive to
    my own awkward goofball self. After the 3rd or 4th note, his identity was revealed to me. I had my friend pass along the message to him “thank you, I am flattered, but I am dating someone “. Which I was…it was around the time I met Mr. B.

  49. Last time I went to the gym…college days…I took a towel to put over any benches I sat or laid on. Big, roided, meatboys left their body juices on everything and I didn’t want it on me.

  50. First rule, ignore the ones screaming for attention. Brings to mind the hot crazy matrix.

  51. Heidi is proud of her ass.

  52. Just saw this meme:

    Immature: A word used by boring people to describe fun people.

  53. Eh, I’m pretty shabby right now, and I have the gut of a man who hasn’t fought hard to avoid one in a while. I actually think it’s important she see that. I’m not Keanu or Hugh Jackman, but neither will most the men she meets in life be. Maybe they’ll have a better chance to show good character if she doesn’t immediately write them off.

  54. I was happy to see the yoga pants craze has continued for young ladies when they travel, the airports from my recent trip where full of things to see. #sunglasses indoors

  55. hahahahaha, That pic Carin just posted…hahahahahah

    Yeah, she doesn’t want anyone looking at her butt.


  56. Totally different from being a stripper….

  57. I followed your link to the blanket skirt CARin, the only two pictures of the blirt in action were dudes. Just sayin.

  58. they have women wearing them on the home page. they look cute.

  59. Shape and fitness are two different things. Healthy lifestyle is your lead by example goal. Everything in moderation, strong mind / strong body.

    What she finds attractive maybe beyond your influence. In my lifetime, big asses and beards (hate em both) have trended as attractive. Im wondering what all these young women are going to do when gravity takes its inevitable toll? Be interesting if the furniture industry has to adjust seat size in the future.

  60. Followup on Jay’s Thursday poat.

    To the tune of Bohemian Rhapsody.

    Is this a burnt pie?
    Is this just done pastry?
    Caught in an oven
    No escape from 450 degrees
    Open your eyes
    Look up at the box and see,
    It’s just a poor pie, please give it sympathy
    Because the oven temp
    Was set too high, now it’s time to say goodbye.
    Any way the smoke blows
    Seems like the pie’s done.
    To me…
    To me…
    Sharon, just killed a pie
    Left the oven on too high
    Now the pie’s as black as night…

  61. ^^^ credit to Dawn Zielinski, not me.

    I did write a poem about a work task, mainly because the challenge was thrown out there, and it beats having to put together another Powerpoint deck. I’ll be reading it to the team on Thursday.

  62. I think the Scots invented those about 400 years ago.

  63. I just read Romie’s lancet link above, and I came to the part about the hospital outbreak in Israel where 4 out of 24 infected folks DIED and I thought that can’t be right. So I followed the footnote link and yep. Outbreak in a hospital contact tracing is all there. This part is what I found even more interesting:

    Moreover, several transmissions probably occurred between two individuals both wearing surgical masks, and in one instance using full PPE, including N-95 mask, face shield, gown and gloves.

  64. The two non-vaccinated patients in that outbreak experienced mild symptoms. The other 22 were vaxed, and 14 of those cases were Severe or Critical.

  65. Heidi is a man-jawed butterface. Her ass is all she has in life.

  66. Comment by Car in on December 5, 2021 10:16 am
    She posted this to her 2000+ followers….


    2K followers is bad for a fitness girl. I’ve got 14K and I don’t even work at it.

  67. I just read Romie’s lancet link above, and I came to the part about the hospital outbreak in Israel where 4 out of 24 infected folks DIED and I thought that can’t be right. So I followed the footnote link and yep. Outbreak in a hospital contact tracing is all there. This part is what I found even more interesting:

    Moreover, several transmissions probably occurred between two individuals both wearing surgical masks, and in one instance using full PPE, including N-95 mask, face shield, gown and gloves.

    Comment by Pupster on December 5, 2021 11:15 am
    The two non-vaccinated patients in that outbreak experienced mild symptoms. The other 22 were vaxed, and 14 of those cases were Severe or Critical.



    Doesn’t this suggest that the vaccine weakens your immune system?

    I admit I may be reading that into it because of my bias.

  68. I have no idea how many followers I have. I never look back.

  69. From the study…

    ConclusionGo to section…

    This nosocomial outbreak exemplifies the high transmissibility of the SARS-CoV-2 Delta variant among twice vaccinated and masked individuals. This suggests some waning of immunity, albeit still providing protection for individuals without comorbidities. However, a third vaccine dose may be needed, particularly in individuals with risk factors for severe COVID-19. Appropriate use of masks, especially in high-risk settings is advised.

  70. Edward Shames died on December 3rd at the age of 99. He was a member of Easy Company which inspired the Band of Brothers book/movies.

  71. And Spur for the win

  72. Friend posted something about a woman in her 20’s having a stroke and then later dying. they said the stroke was caused by “stress”. the point was how society is too stressful.

    And i’m over here thinking she probably died due to the shot.

  73. Bob Dole passed away. RIP, sir.

    I always thought it was so stupid to play up Al Gore’s service when they voted against this guy.

  74. RIP

  75. And i’m over here thinking she probably died due to the shot.


    They are working their asses off trying to make it sound normal that teenagers and elite athletes have strokes and heart attacks from global warming.

    It’s the shot, even dumb people know this.

  76. Oh, I forgot to mention they are blaming the heart attacks on smoking weed too. No.

  77. Pup,

    Congratulations on another fine set of Championship BBF posts. The final vote was quite close and while I personally voted for Sarah, it was a tough call and Jessica is a worthy winner. Looks like the final vote had more international voters than normal.

  78. Weed as a heart disease vector beggars belief. I’d buy lockdowns crushing baseline activity levels, but that wouldn’t help the “imprison the peasants for their own good” narrative.

    That said, weed is the closest thing our Brave New World has to Soma, so they really shouldn’t be demonizing it either. This reeks of desperation.

  79. Weed makes more sense than blaming it on global warming.

  80. Solid point.

  81. “Sources told The Sun that the man said he had “slipped and fell” on the 2.2-inch shell”

    Yes, that is how it happened, I’m certain.

  82. Let he who has never gotten unexploded ordinance stuck in a body cavity cast the first stone.

  83. Probably attends the church with the potato vicar.

  84. A personal trainer told me that a good role of thumb if you’re trying to build muscle mass is one gram of protein per pound of body weight per day, and honestly I can’t fit that much food in my belly. I feel full all the time, and I’m still usually about 70 grams short per day.

  85. This is why the pros all drink whey shakes, bypasses most of your body’s satiety mechanisms.

  86. Lots of seafood helps too.

  87. “Let he who has never gotten unexploded ordinance stuck in a body cavity cast the first stone.”

    Dammit. Got me with the legal mumbo-jumbo. *drops stone*


    (Imgur video with sound)

  89. Shames was the junior lieutenant that Winters said always screamed at his men.

  90. Dammit. Got me with the legal mumbo-jumbo. *drops stone*


  91. Christmas tree is now decorated, and my Secret Santa gift is underneath. Made lamb patties, rice, and purple hull peas for lunch with Rocketboy. DIL not feeling well, so I sent food home with the boy that will either be dinner for her or tomorrow’s lunch for him. Christmas cookies for dessert. Need another round of baking so I can send some to my dad.


  93. I resurrected one of my other favorite TV series last night – Lonesome Dove.

    I remember playing this for HotBride twenty years ago, and told her, “You’re going to love these men before the series is over.” She did.

    Duvall and Jones put in stellar performances.

  94. Lonesome Dove is awesome.

    I started reading Brave New World today, so if I seem unusually paranoid and anti-government for the next little while, that’s why.

  95. By God man, it shouldn’t take some fucking book to make you anti-government at this point.

  96. Hey Y’all. I just saw Wiserbuds time bomb, or at least paid attention to it.
    If it comes to fruition, I just want to share a personal take on our current situation. Agree, disagree, no biggie, we’ve already figured out we’re on our own when the shit storm hits.
    So here I go:
    The most heavily armed street gang in the U.S. is the police.
    Don’t flip out, it gets better, and here’s why:
    The two most dangerous gangs in this country aren’t the Angels, Banditos, Bloods, 13’s, etc., they go by Democrats & Republicans.
    For the sakes of our wives & children the scourge of democrats and republicans needs to be eradicated. Can we develope a vaccine in just 7 months?

  97. No, I’m already anti government. I mean even more so.

  98. I’m reading The Myth of AI while we wait for the Mrs to get home.

  99. That ass chick is hilarious.
    I would have laughed in her face and continued to stare. No rule against it in the gyms I went to.
    Normal social boundaries and propriety were broken by asschick when she arrived naked.
    Uncomfortable can be a two way street.

  100. Lonesome Dove is a book I’ve read 5 times.

  101. Heh, and because I’m old and gross have to be reminded of a few things. One of the few Pulitzer Prize winners I’ve bothered with.

    Didn’t he write the Brokeback Mountain screenplay? uffffff.

    The series was exceptional. Don’t know how many times I’ve seen it.

  102. Mare, have you watched Open Range?

  103. LOL You old rattlesnake! Where the hell have you been? Who’d you see? Who’d you talk to?

  104. Why not 6 times?

  105. ?

  106. Wiserbud just poated on that hoax thread. My WP timeline is linear, not thread by thread. Hopefully he joins us here.

  107. Favorite comment about the “fascist” march in DC – “Kamala sent this group to the National Mall. The knee pads give it away.”

  108. I’m going to be in OKC for a week. Are there any morons there?

  109. Lots of them.

  110. Touché

  111. I should have been more specific.

  112. “You got purdy teeth.”

  113. did someone say moron? I was getting paste

  114. Thanks Scott, they’re okay, I guess.

  115. What color paste?

  116. I spent a year in OKC one night.

  117. I paid good money for my teeth, after having them knocked out by a teeter totter at a church picnic. Back in the days that parents didn’t sue for everything.

  118. just the regular color, we ain’t fancy out here in the sticks

  119. I know wiser has to be careful of his career now that he has a public face. Can’t be seen associating with us racists.

  120. well, all of YOU racists. I’m perfect

  121. Birds of a feather…Jay.

  122. We see him.

    He’s avoiding you.

  123. I figured.

  124. Things haven’t been the same between us since I posted fastest lap time at the Windsor Locks 500.

  125. That was about 10 years ago.

  126. The man can hold a grudge.

  127. Have I told you recently how much I enjoy your banter? Because I really enjoy your banter.

  128. But ir was all good clean fun.

  129. Until Russ from Winterset puked in his helmet.

  130. That part’s not banter, Russ actually vomited in his helmet and became Moron Meatup Legend.

  131. I wasn’t there, dammit. Missed it. I heard about it the next day, from seven people, and I listened attentively each time.

  132. I hope he got that helmet sock bronzed.

  133. We’re getting old, you know. One of you dicks has to host another get-together before we can’t travel without wheelchairs and shit. I already incompetently hosted three of these, Carin competently did two that I attended.

    Who among you will host a Spring meatup? Think about it. Then after thinking about it, disregard everything you considered, and do it anyway. It’s always so great to see each other again.

  134. Look at you getting all sentimental.

  135. The way we elect board presidents is by nominating them when they aren’t in the meeting.

  136. And FTR (as Carin is fond of saying) you and Scott hosted two of the finest meatups we ever had.

  137. Hi Sean.

  138. Derek encouraged Rick’s patriotism.

  139. hi jams. goodnight.

  140. At this point my shopping for Christmas is done but I have no desire to do any wrapping. It may be time to make a Sam’s Club run to pick up a pack of gift bags and festive tissue paper so I can look like I made an effort

  141. We still need to dust off the festive plastic pine tree. We have worried that Ollie would mess around with it but I’m optimistic. We had similar worries about the wood stove but I’ve been feeding the stove on average every other day for the last couple of weeks and other than chewing the occasional piece of bark that falls on the floor he’s been good. “Good” defined as staying the fuck away from the blazing hot stove and the guy feeding it.



    This happened before we knew of the generalized, baseline incompetence of the alphabet agencies. A lot of awareness has happened since that time.

  143. I can always host another meetup. I’ve got the porch for it.

    wakey wakey

  144. My tree is up and lights are on. I was debating if I needed more lights before I started putting on the ornaments.

    Our tree is a tad big.

  145. Daughter is having an existential crisis today, MMM may be a few more minutes.

  146. HA!

    Childrearing, not for the faint of heart.

  147. Yes, I’ve seen Open Range and loved it. I like the genre.

  148. Our tree is up.

    Not the live one, the fake one.

  149. Nice and tall, Jay, I like it.

  150. MMM 473

  151. Existential crisis = monumental tantrum?

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